What a coincidence, I just got an email announcing that Breville intend to orphan my Joule sous vide stick: the existing app will stop working, the new app is only available the US and Canada and in parts of Europe.
Live in another country? You're s.o.l., it wasn't officially sold there. You need a new account as well, hope you like the TOS.
All of this for a device whose core functionality -- setting a target temperature, getting the current temperature and checking for error states -- is both trivial and has no inherent need for internet connectivity.
I suppose I should be grateful they're still supporting a device that's like 10 years old. Caveat emptor (I got it as a gift).
On the one hand, every time I read an article like this I'm vindicated against astroturfed bots claiming that nothing ever happens and this isn't where we're headed.
It is essential to purchase and configure Home Assistant (https://www.home-assistant.io/) compatible devices around the home whenever possible if you want a "smart home" that will last. Everything else is an Internet of Shit treadmill that lasts at most a few years before it falls off and is replaced by a new piece of e-waste.
From get go I considered the whole design with no interface on device a bad idea... Apps can and will often go. Better to have also the local controls.
Don't want to remember how much money I spent on a Copengagen wheel for my wife when she was in school. At least some kind souls published a way to unbrick it.
It's a plus from the manufacturer side - kitchen gadgets you keep more than 10 years.
With required smartphone app, it is almost assured to not work in 10 years, and you have to buy another one. Just another method of planned obsolesence.
That’s just sad ugh, just the other day I was using my pre-shitty-IoT era Sous Vide machine (Anova brand, I think it might have been chefsteps recommended too, got around 2014/2015), and I was thinking how glad I am that it has zero fancy connectivity - just a wheel to set the temperature and a start/stop button and simple led display. Still works great.
I have an Anova sous vide cooker that is also about 10 years old and has an app, but is fully functional without it.
When I bought it the app was free, but then later became a subscription addon. However they grandfathered all original owners into a free lifetime subscription. Pretty classy.
You rented the devices with a full up-front payment, but the manufacturer stuck you with the e-waste problem when they decided to be come an absentee landlord.
This needs to be fixed by regulation. If a device requires an online service to function it (a) needs to be clearly advertised as rental and not a purchase, and (b) the device manufacturer must take the devices back and deal with the e-waste if they discontinue the services or release the software stack (including complete and corresponding source code and build environment) to allow third-parties to host it.
This! Absolutely needed regulation. Why is it that such a clearly beneficial and necessary piece of legislation is not making its way through the legislative bodies of the world while age checks somehow magically appeared universally?
Needing an app for these things is stupid in the first place, but the real kick in the metaphorical nuts is that the needed app should be stored on the device. Want to use your phone to control the device load the program to do so off the device itself.
We really only have one tech stack where this actually works, the web. And I consider this to be either the great failure of the app ecosystem(why on earth do apps need a manual install step?) or amazement that the corporate overlords let the web slip through the gaps.
Is there a way to do web over bluetooth? or is that another missing piece?
For the one I have the app is completely optional. It doesn’t add any capability, it just lets you control it remotely. It will perform all its capabilities just fine without you ever taking your phone out.
For the subscription you also get additional content like recipes and such that I don’t care about. I wouldn’t pay for it.
>a device whose core functionality [...] is both trivial and has no inherent need for internet connectivity.
For a while I've given a hard pass to anything which requires an app for such functionality, knowing full well that eventually I'll be locked out of it (not to mention the privacy implications of such designs).
I hold a licence that allows me to transmit on pretty much whatever frequency I like with as much power as I like, wherever I like.
Someone has to test the transmitter before you hand it off to the customer.
Also, I'm in the UK, where it's hard enough to get the regulatory authorities to do anything about people causing interferenced to licensed chunks of band. You can wipe out the whole of 2.4GHz if you like, you literally could not pay them to take an interest.
Edit: also you have probably done the same a couple of times today too.
So I thought your initial comment was a (pretty good) joke about using a microwave oven, but now I’m not sure. Is this testing license you reference a continuation of the joke or a real thing?
I've found that Claude Code works well at reversing java applications. Even if it is fully obfuscated claude can restore sensible names for everything and understand how it all works and answer questions about what it is doing.
+1. While vibe-coding (natural language to code) is not such a great idea, we can always check the source, so vibe-reverse-engineering (code to natural language) may actually be quite useful.
Super useful. I have a no-name USB microscope that only supported iOS and Android (just look up "USB microscope" on Amazon, there's like 500 versions of the same device). The device doesn't work like a normal webcam so you can't just plug it into a PC, and their mobile software is shady and low quality so I would only ever connected it to a GrapheneOS phone where I could prohibit their app having network access entirely because it gave me a bad feeling. As a result I underused the device since it was annoying.
I recently took their .apk and dropped it in a new empty project folder, instructed Claude Code w/ GLM 5 to reverse engineer the app, assess it for security and privacy concerns out of curiosity and then to probe the USB device to figure out why it doesn't work like a normal UVC webcam. After the investigation and planning I then instructed it to write a new app to use it on my desktop. I pretty much yolo'd it from that point and let AI drive the bus (I did the visual checks of the video stream in the app to provide feedback... while I watching a movie). I wound up with a working Electron app using libusb two hours later. With a Typescipt/C POC in hand as reference in another hour I had functioning Rust + egui application. Visually, both apps are rough around the edges but have complete functional parity with the mobile apps. It took 68 million tokens.
I got codex to vibe reverse engineer two devices from rom dumps recently - a talking timer that uses an 8051 cpu and a custom 5 bit audio format, and an ice cream van chime box that used a z80 and a ym2149 sound chip. Quite simple devices, but it did a great job. also made a web-based emulator for both. apparently WASM is hard, but I didn't notice.
Interesting, I'd have assumed the guardrails would disallow them from doing anything like that, regardless of legality. Do you need to "convince" it to do it or no questions asked?
Naming is an area where LLMs are useful; but I'd still use a regular Java decompiler (there are quite a few of these around) for the actual decompilation part.
Why would you say "semi-legally"? Nothing "semi" here. What is "semi-legal" is making hardware e-waste by deciding it is "no longer supported". It is "semi" legal because it is legal under the corrupt political systems in most of the world but is criminal against humanity and the planet we all call home. In that sense if you can prevent e-waste trough any means you are a hero.
I really liked the video. I didn't realize you could build programs for no longer supported hardware like this.
I had a similar epifany with SVG, there was an image that I needed to keep editing and then one day I opened the SVG file and realized it's a very readable file and then just built a python script that would modify the SVG file.
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Live in another country? You're s.o.l., it wasn't officially sold there. You need a new account as well, hope you like the TOS.
All of this for a device whose core functionality -- setting a target temperature, getting the current temperature and checking for error states -- is both trivial and has no inherent need for internet connectivity.
I suppose I should be grateful they're still supporting a device that's like 10 years old. Caveat emptor (I got it as a gift).
https://community.chefsteps.com/discussion/78615/joule-sous-...
What has gone wrong with humanity, that we need to advertise that as a feature if you download a new app?
On the other hand, I don't want to be vindicated.
With required smartphone app, it is almost assured to not work in 10 years, and you have to buy another one. Just another method of planned obsolesence.
When I bought it the app was free, but then later became a subscription addon. However they grandfathered all original owners into a free lifetime subscription. Pretty classy.
This needs to be fixed by regulation. If a device requires an online service to function it (a) needs to be clearly advertised as rental and not a purchase, and (b) the device manufacturer must take the devices back and deal with the e-waste if they discontinue the services or release the software stack (including complete and corresponding source code and build environment) to allow third-parties to host it.
We really only have one tech stack where this actually works, the web. And I consider this to be either the great failure of the app ecosystem(why on earth do apps need a manual install step?) or amazement that the corporate overlords let the web slip through the gaps.
Is there a way to do web over bluetooth? or is that another missing piece?
For the subscription you also get additional content like recipes and such that I don’t care about. I wouldn’t pay for it.
>a device whose core functionality [...] is both trivial and has no inherent need for internet connectivity.
For a while I've given a hard pass to anything which requires an app for such functionality, knowing full well that eventually I'll be locked out of it (not to mention the privacy implications of such designs).
I encourage others to follow suit.
The ability to cook with or without WiFi anywhere, anytime.
I'm currently full QRO on the 13cm band with something around 1600W EIRP CW, and will be for several minutes until the curry base defrosts.
>WiFi
>1600W EIRP
Your local regulatory authority would like a word with you.
Someone has to test the transmitter before you hand it off to the customer.
Also, I'm in the UK, where it's hard enough to get the regulatory authorities to do anything about people causing interferenced to licensed chunks of band. You can wipe out the whole of 2.4GHz if you like, you literally could not pay them to take an interest.
Edit: also you have probably done the same a couple of times today too.
> You've always needed an account to operate your Joule Sous Vide with the Joule app. This is not a new requirement.
Absolute comedy.
It would be cool... For anyone who does not want children one day.
“Ambition is the willingness to kill the things you love and eat them to survive”
They grandfathered me in, of-course, but it still is absolutely disgusting.
It should be mandatory to build systems with local connections in mind. mDNS is a thing.
I recently took their .apk and dropped it in a new empty project folder, instructed Claude Code w/ GLM 5 to reverse engineer the app, assess it for security and privacy concerns out of curiosity and then to probe the USB device to figure out why it doesn't work like a normal UVC webcam. After the investigation and planning I then instructed it to write a new app to use it on my desktop. I pretty much yolo'd it from that point and let AI drive the bus (I did the visual checks of the video stream in the app to provide feedback... while I watching a movie). I wound up with a working Electron app using libusb two hours later. With a Typescipt/C POC in hand as reference in another hour I had functioning Rust + egui application. Visually, both apps are rough around the edges but have complete functional parity with the mobile apps. It took 68 million tokens.
EULAs be damned, even the DMCA has exceptions for RE in the name of interoperability and repair.
I moved to a different country and the app is not on google play store in the new geography.
Even when it is installed somehow it is absolutely unreliable in pairing or controlling the device.
Wish I had time to go on a quest and reverse engineer and build my own better controller.