Some of these really don't make sense. The implication that Cursor is a fraudulent company is a little weird considering they actually have real users.
Like sure, is it a VS code fork with agents stapled to it? Yes. But are they on the same scale as most of the people mentioned? Ehh probably not.
It reads more like a hit piece from someone with a grudge against random SF companies than anything else.
> The implication that Cursor is a fraudulent company is a little weird
To my reading the premise of the site is pretty straightforward: 30 Under 30 is a warning sign, not a positive signal. Therefore, as a company with 4 founders who were in 30 Under 30, Cursor is a risk.
It’s a silly little satire site, there’s a danger of reading into it too deeply.
Yeah, and the reason 30 under 30 is a warning sign is because the founders that apply to and agree to do Forbes to do "30 under 30" are much more concerned with marketing than actually building a legitimate product. Legitimate under 30 founders are spending their time actually building instead.
Maybe it was added after your comment but that section has a warning box calling the score a "deliberately absurd formula" and saying "this is comedy" in literal bold letters at the top. No one thinks it's serious and it's even clearly labeled as a joke just in case.
Reactions to this are a bit curious. It's a satirical comment on how (presumably) initially well-intentioned younger founder-types get swept up in / by perverse incentives. The implication is that younger people who are still figuring out who they are and coming into their own may be more susceptible to these kinds of incentive traps.
The first section that showcases the fraud that has been committed is something I have no problem with, just as I have no issue with web3isgoinggreat.com. The "at risk" section is based on a mathematical/algorithmic joke. This is explained by the "methodology" section below it, which makes it clear that the equation used to calculate "risk" here is not entirely unlike the Drake equation for the probability of extra-terrestrial life.[1]
Eh, I think selection effects are more prevalent than an earnest good faith actor who got swept up into perverse incentives.
Forbes 30u30 is a clarion call for the most ambitiously Machiavellian among us.
They’re not subject to any different incentives than the rest of us. But they’d certainly have a higher rate of sociopaths and more garden variety Machiavellis than genpop.
I was curious to pin down the definition of Machiavellian:
> Manipulation & Deceit: Using charm, lies, and calculated moves to influence others.
> Lack of Empathy: A cold, detached, and unemotional demeanor that disregards the feelings of others.
> Strategic Long-Term Planning: Unlike impulsive psychopaths, high-Machs are patient, planning, and can delay gratification to ensure success.
> Cynical Worldview: Believing that people are inherently weak, untrustworthy, and that "the ends justify the means".
> Low Affect: Possessing limited emotional experience, often leading to a detached, "puppet-master" role rather than seeking the spotlight.
The only traits that seem bad are the lying and lack of empathy. The rest seem neutral (low emotional experience is something we hackers tend to identify with), sensible (random people tend to be untrustworthy), or admirable (delayed gratification).
Using charm and calculated moves to influence others isn’t a bad thing. It’s the basis of flattery.
I wish there was a positive version of Machiavellian which cut the lies and lack of empathy. Those are genuinely bad.
The Nikola founder, and Anthony Levandowski for that matter (seems to have gone under the radar), have got to be the most egregious case of corruption and pay-for-play. It's so depressing that no one can do anything about it.
The "watchlist" made me a bit uncomfortable. I get that it's satire, but putting real people's names in a list of people you're (even jokingly) watching for fraud, and assigning a "risk factor" to them (even/especially if they acknowledge it's made up) borders on defamation in my book.
If you didn't know, 30 under 30 doesn't have a selection process and you can literally apply and game your way into being mentioned. I honestly love the site and the UI. Great job! Would be nice to have some kind of thing for YC founders as well
Would say, the 30 under 30 list has like 600 people, not 30. So the fraud rate is quite a bit lower than headlines of seemingly 2 / 30. Its more like 2 / 600, which is maybe the baseline fraud rate?
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Like sure, is it a VS code fork with agents stapled to it? Yes. But are they on the same scale as most of the people mentioned? Ehh probably not.
It reads more like a hit piece from someone with a grudge against random SF companies than anything else.
> The implication that Cursor is a fraudulent company is a little weird
To my reading the premise of the site is pretty straightforward: 30 Under 30 is a warning sign, not a positive signal. Therefore, as a company with 4 founders who were in 30 Under 30, Cursor is a risk.
It’s a silly little satire site, there’s a danger of reading into it too deeply.
If there's no wrong-doing, then there's nothing of which to be ashamed.
The first section that showcases the fraud that has been committed is something I have no problem with, just as I have no issue with web3isgoinggreat.com. The "at risk" section is based on a mathematical/algorithmic joke. This is explained by the "methodology" section below it, which makes it clear that the equation used to calculate "risk" here is not entirely unlike the Drake equation for the probability of extra-terrestrial life.[1]
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drake_equation
Forbes 30u30 is a clarion call for the most ambitiously Machiavellian among us.
They’re not subject to any different incentives than the rest of us. But they’d certainly have a higher rate of sociopaths and more garden variety Machiavellis than genpop.
> Manipulation & Deceit: Using charm, lies, and calculated moves to influence others.
> Lack of Empathy: A cold, detached, and unemotional demeanor that disregards the feelings of others.
> Strategic Long-Term Planning: Unlike impulsive psychopaths, high-Machs are patient, planning, and can delay gratification to ensure success.
> Cynical Worldview: Believing that people are inherently weak, untrustworthy, and that "the ends justify the means".
> Low Affect: Possessing limited emotional experience, often leading to a detached, "puppet-master" role rather than seeking the spotlight.
The only traits that seem bad are the lying and lack of empathy. The rest seem neutral (low emotional experience is something we hackers tend to identify with), sensible (random people tend to be untrustworthy), or admirable (delayed gratification).
Using charm and calculated moves to influence others isn’t a bad thing. It’s the basis of flattery.
I wish there was a positive version of Machiavellian which cut the lies and lack of empathy. Those are genuinely bad.
> Using charm and calculated moves to influence others isn’t a bad thing. It’s the basis of flattery.
Flattery doesn't have to be calculated.
As to calculated moves, distinct things can fit the same labels. Intent, context, and execution are all important.
Starts looking like low effort libel, punching down, more than some clever joke x a statistics exercise
Put another way: the Drake equation, this ain’t.
I consider myself a good judge of character, because not one of the one's I've invested in has committed fraud!
> Risk Index
> Mercor — 3x on 30u30
Interesting, I only know this company because they’re the leading spammer hitting my inbox in the AI job board category.