The deluge of gambling ads on TV during Friday night footy is absolutely appalling. There’s a very robust conduit for normalising sports gambling through advertisements around the broadcasts and it’s clearly influencing young adults. I’ve noticed a dramatic uptick in how common it is compared to when I was that age.
An argument I've heard is that by legalizing betting, it can be more easily monitored with regulation and reduce the amount of black market betting. People still bet when it's illegal, it just becomes harder to track, which makes it easier for gamblers to interfere with outcomes without detection.
It sounds kind of similar to the legalization of certain recreational drugs. For example, alcohol prohibition resulted in a massive black market with organized criminal gangs, and many places realized it's better to regulate it rather than prohibit it.
I think for gambling, we need better regulations, and the Australian government seems to think so too.
Almost nobody was betting in the black market before the legalization. Sure you obviously had some people, but friction was big enough where it was not worth it. Right now, there isn’t a single game where people are talking about the bets they made in NA.
Nothing should be black and white. Even for alcohol and drug abuse, we should look at each and evaluate.
I don't know about Australia but there was an enormous amount of black market sports gambling in the USA before it was widely legalized. People who were unaware of this were just oblivious or led very sheltered lives. Broad legalization may have been a net negative for society but it's a complex issue.
define enormous? before it was legalized I knew one mate that was a gambler. I don’t have a friend anymore who does not sports gamble, hardly have relatives that don’t sports gamble. die-hard fans of teams now don’t give a hoot if the team wins (especially in the regular season)… not saying this is not a complicated issue but to say market was enormous is very much removed from reality
Yep it's hard to build a large liquid market for both sides of the bet without a central platform being legal. Look at polymarket as another example of things that people wouldn't bet on if a (legal in some countries) platform didn't exist.
Very few people gambled illegally. Putting some gangster out of business (Lol if you actually believe that) at the cost of addicting the entire working class to throwing away their money is bad math!
Illegal gambling has been rife for a very long time - the bookie down the pub taking bets on horses, games, whatever
Add to that that the Costigan Commission (1984) and the Fitzgerald Inquiry (1989) proved that illegal gambling was the foundational "river of gold" for organised crime in Australia.
my grandma is not going to be looking for a black market bookie. some percentage of people will be no matter what though if you make penalties really severe you will significantly thin out this crowd.
without gambling though, pat mahomes would be making less money that I am making…
The ads are going to continue from 8:30pm on, NRL has a game starting at 8pm this evening, the gambling ads will hit just before half time under this new legislation
That's a nice start but it's really just a band aid over the real problem, kind of like how politicians don't actually want to solve the underlying issue but instead just want to be seen to do something.
The real insanity is just gambling in Australia. As the article mentioned the people in the country have the highest losses to gambling anywhere in the world. This goes beyond sports betting, as that is just the latest thing, to poker machines (slot machines for you USA people) and other online gambling (cough Kick & related companies cough).
I am old enough to remember the introduction of poker machines in pubs and clubs here in Australia and it was always framed as a personal choice and government revenue source but all it did was result in money going from families to the big corporate "entertainment venue" operators (pub and club owners). I'd love it if Australia got rid of all gambling from normal parts of society and limited it to strictly regulated casinos (at most), but the gambling industry is so firmly entrenched in politics and society that I don't see any change happening soon
A great first step. I'd love to see a sin tax associated with this as well - ie, for adverts that do run, they should have to pay a % of the ad fee to the government.
I don't think people understand just how ingrained in the culture gambling is in Australia. One of the primary 3rd spaces for people in Australia are RSLs, which are technically clubs for veterans to get co-op like services, but have evolved into a 3rd space for everyone that offer food, alcohol, entertainment, and of course, sports gambling and "pokies" (poker/slot machines).
I fashion myself a bit of a fan of football and an occasional F1 viewer, and I must say, every time I watch a live event with friends I can't help but mention how betting houses have completely taken over the advertising space. Betson, Betano, Betway, bet365,etc... that and the pervasive Crypto.com it is unbelievable how they are trying to find a niche in this demographic. The crypto ones are the best, it's like they are not even trying to hide the nature of the business any more.
Some companies now make advertisements of news websites that it is clear are also part of betting companies. For example, https://www.admiralbet.news/ has as other Google result the betting website. However, I do have to say it is still less than before and it's much better
> "Today it's gambling advertising, tomorrow it's alcohol, then it's sugary drinks, fast food, critical minerals and who knows what else comes next," chief executive Kai Cantwell said.
We have already learned our lesson. Prohibition doesn’t work. But advertising does work. Banning advertising also works. We should allow people the freedom to participate in vice, but ban all advertising for it. Anything harmful to society should not be advertised. No ads for cars, guns, recreational drugs including alcohol, unhealthy food, fossil fuels, or gambling.
Who knows what comes next Kai? Hopefully everything.
People reading this may not realize how pervasive gambling is in Australia thanks to poker machines ("pokies"). These are slot machines, basically. And they're everywhere with one exception: they're illegal outside of casinos in Western Australia.
In every other state, you can walk into many pubs and RSLs ("Retired Servicemen's Leagues", veteran's clubs, basically) and sit there and lose your house. Pokies can be the only thing keeping many businesses in business. They licenses are so valuable that some businesses are bought simply so the licenses can be transferred. Some state governments realize this so reduce the number of licenses on transfer (eg you buy a business wih 20 pokies and you get to transfer 16 and lose 4). This had the predictable outcome of having pokie licenses skyrocket in value.
AFAIK sportsbetting (eg DraftKings) is illegal in Australia because the government has realized how damaging it is yet pokies remain legal.
Oh it's worth adding that Stake, which is headquartered in a shack in Curacao for legal reasons, was started and run by Australians who have absolutely raked in the cash to the point of now being billionaires.
Another problematic part of all this is how gambling has been effectively used for money laundering. The casinos already got hit for allowing this to happen. Pokiies and smaller establishments remain a loophole.
Consider the case of Troy Stolz [1], who leaked documents about ClubsNSW not complying with anti-money laundering and compliance. ClubsNSW was able to bring a private criminal prosecution about this. Youtuber Jordan Shanks-Markovina had his house firebombed (allegedly over this) [2].
Youtuber Boy Boy showed how ridiculously lax AML is with gambling [3].
> "Today it's gambling advertising, tomorrow it's alcohol, then it's sugary drinks, fast food, critical minerals and who knows what else comes next," chief executive Kai Cantwell said.
Good? I really hope that we are approaching a day when we realize that advertising itself is harmful, and leads to contra-social behavior in general.
This is all I see on ad supporteed TV at night here in the UK. And half the time during the day. It's a serious problem coupled with, I assume, serious lobbyists here in the UK.
I wonder how much the business of online ads and gambling gaming (so called social casino) is. What happens if they both get banned? Must cause a huge amount of loss of revenue from the cloud operators at least.
I can't tell if this thread is filled with bookie shills or (buy a mcNuke level)die hard libertarians or people who live under a rock and don't realize how pervasive sports gambling is.
Weak reforms, I'm disappointed and will write to my MP to express that sentiment.
Frankly all advertising for gambling on TV, radio, social media, bus stops - everywhere - should be banned the same as we did for cigarette ads in the 90s.
It basically killed a bunch of racing teams that I was a fan of but it needed to be done.
103 comments
The deluge of gambling ads on TV during Friday night footy is absolutely appalling. There’s a very robust conduit for normalising sports gambling through advertisements around the broadcasts and it’s clearly influencing young adults. I’ve noticed a dramatic uptick in how common it is compared to when I was that age.
It sounds kind of similar to the legalization of certain recreational drugs. For example, alcohol prohibition resulted in a massive black market with organized criminal gangs, and many places realized it's better to regulate it rather than prohibit it.
I think for gambling, we need better regulations, and the Australian government seems to think so too.
Nothing should be black and white. Even for alcohol and drug abuse, we should look at each and evaluate.
Illegal gambling has been rife for a very long time - the bookie down the pub taking bets on horses, games, whatever
Add to that that the Costigan Commission (1984) and the Fitzgerald Inquiry (1989) proved that illegal gambling was the foundational "river of gold" for organised crime in Australia.
without gambling though, pat mahomes would be making less money that I am making…
If people were just going to do it anyway, these gambling companies wouldn’t be pouring billions into advertising to stimulate demand
People die during parachuting and climbing mount everest. What's the upside really beyond “People enjoy doing it and it's their own life.”?
As a case study look at the impact sites like CSGOLounge had on the popularity of competitive CSGO.
The real insanity is just gambling in Australia. As the article mentioned the people in the country have the highest losses to gambling anywhere in the world. This goes beyond sports betting, as that is just the latest thing, to poker machines (slot machines for you USA people) and other online gambling (cough Kick & related companies cough).
I am old enough to remember the introduction of poker machines in pubs and clubs here in Australia and it was always framed as a personal choice and government revenue source but all it did was result in money going from families to the big corporate "entertainment venue" operators (pub and club owners). I'd love it if Australia got rid of all gambling from normal parts of society and limited it to strictly regulated casinos (at most), but the gambling industry is so firmly entrenched in politics and society that I don't see any change happening soon
Gambling ruins lives.
I don't think people understand just how ingrained in the culture gambling is in Australia. One of the primary 3rd spaces for people in Australia are RSLs, which are technically clubs for veterans to get co-op like services, but have evolved into a 3rd space for everyone that offer food, alcohol, entertainment, and of course, sports gambling and "pokies" (poker/slot machines).
Some companies now make advertisements of news websites that it is clear are also part of betting companies. For example, https://www.admiralbet.news/ has as other Google result the betting website. However, I do have to say it is still less than before and it's much better
-----------
And thus, the ten minute Australian gambling ad was born.
> "Today it's gambling advertising, tomorrow it's alcohol, then it's sugary drinks, fast food, critical minerals and who knows what else comes next," chief executive Kai Cantwell said.
We have already learned our lesson. Prohibition doesn’t work. But advertising does work. Banning advertising also works. We should allow people the freedom to participate in vice, but ban all advertising for it. Anything harmful to society should not be advertised. No ads for cars, guns, recreational drugs including alcohol, unhealthy food, fossil fuels, or gambling.
Who knows what comes next Kai? Hopefully everything.
In every other state, you can walk into many pubs and RSLs ("Retired Servicemen's Leagues", veteran's clubs, basically) and sit there and lose your house. Pokies can be the only thing keeping many businesses in business. They licenses are so valuable that some businesses are bought simply so the licenses can be transferred. Some state governments realize this so reduce the number of licenses on transfer (eg you buy a business wih 20 pokies and you get to transfer 16 and lose 4). This had the predictable outcome of having pokie licenses skyrocket in value.
AFAIK sportsbetting (eg DraftKings) is illegal in Australia because the government has realized how damaging it is yet pokies remain legal.
Oh it's worth adding that Stake, which is headquartered in a shack in Curacao for legal reasons, was started and run by Australians who have absolutely raked in the cash to the point of now being billionaires.
Another problematic part of all this is how gambling has been effectively used for money laundering. The casinos already got hit for allowing this to happen. Pokiies and smaller establishments remain a loophole.
Consider the case of Troy Stolz [1], who leaked documents about ClubsNSW not complying with anti-money laundering and compliance. ClubsNSW was able to bring a private criminal prosecution about this. Youtuber Jordan Shanks-Markovina had his house firebombed (allegedly over this) [2].
Youtuber Boy Boy showed how ridiculously lax AML is with gambling [3].
[1]: https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2023/feb/07/clubs...
[2]: https://independentaustralia.net/life/life-display/friendlyj...
[3]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DoyH1dgj8Lo
> "Today it's gambling advertising, tomorrow it's alcohol, then it's sugary drinks, fast food, critical minerals and who knows what else comes next," chief executive Kai Cantwell said.
Good? I really hope that we are approaching a day when we realize that advertising itself is harmful, and leads to contra-social behavior in general.
https://youtu.be/ZI3zaHUsgXg
https://youtu.be/jZivPIRvi0U
Frankly all advertising for gambling on TV, radio, social media, bus stops - everywhere - should be banned the same as we did for cigarette ads in the 90s.
It basically killed a bunch of racing teams that I was a fan of but it needed to be done.