Maybe, just maybe, the previous generation (I include myself here) have lost the plot raising/educating children and are breeding just absolute disrespectful, egotistical, attention seeking assholes as younger generations.
Teachers in the classrooms have been globally sounding the alarms for decades about the loss of discipline, the loss of basic manners, the loss of respect for authority, the loss of empathy, the attention issues (attention seeking and attention impairment), the increase entitlement, the inability to cope with negatives, the increase in illiteracy, etc.. No one has listened. Then things go wrong and we blame the teachers.
It is ok for kids to be mischievous. It is ok for young adults to take the piss out of each other in a healthy way. But this looks to me like an education problem. That kind of value based education where parents used to educate kids to be compassionate to each other, to respect each other and to f**ng understand that if a moment of fun with some friends could ruin someone else's life maybe it is not worth being the cool dude for 5 minutes. We have lost that. Most kids do not have these values these days.
But what did we expect? We have been systematically ditching those values. We have an older generation now that is selfish, egotistical, careless and dismissive with anything that it is not them and their belief framework whatever that is. We have polarised to the extent of hatred. And this is showing in society. It is showing in our kids.
I don't think tech is to blame. I don't think kids are to blame. This might be our fault.
Hate to bring the 'failure and discredit of institutions' cards, but before all the talk around the diminishing respect and importance of 'big/important' institutions - the school/teacher institution was already failing. And it's not just the kids, parents were the first to start dismissing the teachers/schools - and teaching their kids in the process.
Everything else you mention (empathy, attention, bullying, etc) I'm not sure we are worst off now - let's not idealize the past. Different generations just find different ways to be deranged.
"…parents used to educate kids to be compassionate to each other…"
No, I think it absolutely is "tech". Clicks, upvotes, attention are the reward and coin of social media. It looks as though the more debasing the content, the higher the reward—tech is encouraging bad behavior.
> the previous generation (I include myself here) have lost the plot raising/educating children and are breeding just absolute disrespectful, egotistical, attention seeking assholes as younger generations.
In other words, people are raising winners and winners get to do what they want, like Ricky Bobby and Donald Trump.
For what is worth, coming to Canada and having kids here, I noticed how much time in school is invested in talking about emotions, learning to interact with other humans, taking care of others.
A huge difference with my country of origin: Italy.
That stuff simply is not taught in school.
I'd like to think that this is the reason why canadians are considered so polite,but I guess I will see the results in 15 years from now.
Kids have been beating each other up, dunking their heads in toilets, spreading rumors, upending garbage cans on each other, etc for as long as there have been kids. The bullying rate is actually at ~2/3 of what it used to be. I definitely agree from what I've heard from teachers that classroom kids are more unruly and disrespectful than before, but I don't think it's really tied to them being assholes to each other.
No, people were definitely much, much worse in the past. Rape was more prevelent, so was racism and homophobia. It was basically okay to physically harm people so long as they were "weirdos", whatever that meant at the time.
Maybe, just maybe, prudish attitudes regarding sex weren't arbitrary rules invented by a patriarchal society but are actually rooted in human behaviour, checks that kept our more debased impulses in line. Not something to be toppled in the name of progress, culture, and sophistication without any regard for second-order consequences.
> Maybe, just maybe, the previous generation (I include myself here) have lost the plot raising/educating children and are breeding just absolute disrespectful, egotistical, attention seeking assholes as younger generations.
> ...
> That kind of value based education where parents used to educate kids to be compassionate to each other, to respect each other and to f*ng understand that if a moment of fun with some friends could ruin someone else's life maybe it is not worth being the cool dude for 5 minutes. We have lost that. Most kids do not have these values these days.
> ...
> I don't think tech is to blame. I don't think kids are to blame. This might be our fault.
I don't think just one thing is to blame, and it's a fool's errand to try to pin it on one thing.
But here's a cause I think you missed: corporate capitalism, and the rise of dual-income families. Before you blame the parents, realize they're probably working for "the man" instead of being around their kids when teachable moments happen. The kids spend most of their days from infancy to adulthood in some kind of institutional setting (daycare to school) with the legal minimum adult-to-child ratio (business is business!), and the family all comes together exhausted at the ass-end of the day. We're in the second or third generation of that.
This situation is good for business. You take a working solution, and split it into two problems that business can make money "solving": business gets more of the parents labor, and more of their money because they have to pay for childcare while they work.
Part of the story of the last 40+ years is business cannibalizing society (families, community, civil society) for private gains. And they protect their gains because the social problems are somewhat multi-factoral, so they can always pay for propaganda and redirect the blame away from themselves. There's a reason why "blame the parents, make them fix it" is so tempting and "blame business, make them fix it" is taboo.
I have multiple teenagers. The desire to bully is the same as it ever was. There are still terrible parents who raise terrible kids. It's just that there are new tools to do it with.
144 comments
Teachers in the classrooms have been globally sounding the alarms for decades about the loss of discipline, the loss of basic manners, the loss of respect for authority, the loss of empathy, the attention issues (attention seeking and attention impairment), the increase entitlement, the inability to cope with negatives, the increase in illiteracy, etc.. No one has listened. Then things go wrong and we blame the teachers.
It is ok for kids to be mischievous. It is ok for young adults to take the piss out of each other in a healthy way. But this looks to me like an education problem. That kind of value based education where parents used to educate kids to be compassionate to each other, to respect each other and to f**ng understand that if a moment of fun with some friends could ruin someone else's life maybe it is not worth being the cool dude for 5 minutes. We have lost that. Most kids do not have these values these days.
But what did we expect? We have been systematically ditching those values. We have an older generation now that is selfish, egotistical, careless and dismissive with anything that it is not them and their belief framework whatever that is. We have polarised to the extent of hatred. And this is showing in society. It is showing in our kids.
I don't think tech is to blame. I don't think kids are to blame. This might be our fault.
Everything else you mention (empathy, attention, bullying, etc) I'm not sure we are worst off now - let's not idealize the past. Different generations just find different ways to be deranged.
No, I think it absolutely is "tech". Clicks, upvotes, attention are the reward and coin of social media. It looks as though the more debasing the content, the higher the reward—tech is encouraging bad behavior.
> That kind of value based education where parents used to educate kids to be compassionate to each other, to respect each other...
No, we used to teach them to hide their cruelties and told them which targets were acceptable. Ask anybody who experienced being gay before 2000.
> the previous generation (I include myself here) have lost the plot raising/educating children and are breeding just absolute disrespectful, egotistical, attention seeking assholes as younger generations.
In other words, people are raising winners and winners get to do what they want, like Ricky Bobby and Donald Trump.
Talladega Nights (2006) exposed this change in US culture twenty years ago. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eY5VNDvea1M&t=189s
A huge difference with my country of origin: Italy.
That stuff simply is not taught in school.
I'd like to think that this is the reason why canadians are considered so polite,but I guess I will see the results in 15 years from now.
>absolute disrespectful, egotistical, attention seeking assholes
Are you talking about kids, or about who a large majority of you has elected a second time to the highest office in the most powerful nation?
What example parents who elected Trump are giving to their kids? And now they act surprised?
> Maybe, just maybe, the previous generation (I include myself here) have lost the plot raising/educating children and are breeding just absolute disrespectful, egotistical, attention seeking assholes as younger generations.
> ...
> That kind of value based education where parents used to educate kids to be compassionate to each other, to respect each other and to f*ng understand that if a moment of fun with some friends could ruin someone else's life maybe it is not worth being the cool dude for 5 minutes. We have lost that. Most kids do not have these values these days.
> ...
> I don't think tech is to blame. I don't think kids are to blame. This might be our fault.
I don't think just one thing is to blame, and it's a fool's errand to try to pin it on one thing.
But here's a cause I think you missed: corporate capitalism, and the rise of dual-income families. Before you blame the parents, realize they're probably working for "the man" instead of being around their kids when teachable moments happen. The kids spend most of their days from infancy to adulthood in some kind of institutional setting (daycare to school) with the legal minimum adult-to-child ratio (business is business!), and the family all comes together exhausted at the ass-end of the day. We're in the second or third generation of that.
This situation is good for business. You take a working solution, and split it into two problems that business can make money "solving": business gets more of the parents labor, and more of their money because they have to pay for childcare while they work.
Part of the story of the last 40+ years is business cannibalizing society (families, community, civil society) for private gains. And they protect their gains because the social problems are somewhat multi-factoral, so they can always pay for propaganda and redirect the blame away from themselves. There's a reason why "blame the parents, make them fix it" is so tempting and "blame business, make them fix it" is taboo.